SX3 crashes when I move parts in midi editor...

swf · Member Joined: 16 Feb 2005 Posts: 142 Location: Hollywood

Hello All,

My first problem with SX3 comes in the form of a constant crash when I move parts in the midi editor. Not always right away but eventually I get the "beach ball of death" while moving midi parts in the editor. It spins "forever" leaving me no choice but to manually shut down my computer by holding the on/off button. I can't quit or force quit once the beach ball starts its never ending spin.

I searched the forum but did not see anything like this. Maybe because when I enter the search words "crash, midi, editor, and SX3" it pulls up 100 posts.

I've tried adjusting latency in the "device setup" window and it made no difference.

I need help please, mainly because a lot of my work revolves around editing midi.

Thanks,

swf
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swingstate · Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2006 3:04 am Post subject:

I've had this problem too. I don't get the spinning ball though. I've been getting something called QD crashes when moving parts around. Interesting, just today Cubase was open and I was attempting to move an unrelated folder of files from an external disc and I got the QD crash. It only crashed Cubase and I wan't doing anything in the program! Other programs open were untouched. It seems to be Mac related, but tied into or irritated by Cubase somehow. Unfortunately I have yet to find out what this even is or why it's happening. Compare your crash logs with mine. Maybe you've got a similar affliction. Hopefully the next big update will take care of some of these irritations.

http://www.cubase.net/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=36692&highlight=
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antelope · Guest

I recently had Cubase death spin while saving a project file!

When this happens, open the 'Activity Monitor' (/Applications/Utilities), open up Cubase and press [Sample]. This will tell you what Cubase is doing while it is stuck.

My sample of the saving bug showed it in functions like "semaphore_wait_signal_trap" and "__spin_lock_relinquish", which means that it is a concurrency bug. Concurrency bugs are rare, impossible to duplicate, and almost impossible to find and fix. I don't think anyone has submitted reproducable steps on these concurrency bugs Cubase has. I think it has to do with MIDI being received and not processed right while Cubase is trying to do something else, hence the sorts of things that make this freeze happen vary.

swf · Member Joined: 16 Feb 2005 Posts: 142 Location: Hollywood

Hello antelope,

Next time it happens I'll open the activity monitor.

What your saying sounds like it could be true. It always happens when I have a loop playing during my editing and it sometime causes the midi instrument to get stuck. (you know how sometimes it will just hold a note forever)

I really hope it can be fixed because I use the midi editors like a madman.
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antelope · Guest

Hm, the loop playing sounds familiar. I will start to try and notice if it is more likely to hang during a loop. For me, the hanging is extremely rare. It happened a few days ago is why I remember it, but before that I think it was many months since a hang. Of course I avoid areas that cause crashes no matter what you do like the Score editor. If I was trying to do scoring I'm sure I'd have more reports.

0dB · Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2006 9:37 am Post subject:

i had the spinball-problem as well.
i downgraded to sx 3.02 and the problem was solved.
there are a lot of threads here in the forum to this problem.
we are not allone Wink

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swf · Member Joined: 16 Feb 2005 Posts: 142 Location: Hollywood

Hello 0db and antelope,

I use the KEY EDITOR the most. In fact I've only had the problem so far in the key editor when I'm moving parts. (notes)

I'm not to big on downgrading so I'll see what else I can find out first. If the problems continues I'll try your suggestion.

In the mean time I'll search other posts.

swf
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prism · Posted: Fri Feb 03, 2006 3:30 pm Post subject:

Yes. It happened to me running SX 3.1.1 under both OS 10.3.9 and OS 10.4.

I downgraded to 3.0.2 and all is fine, though I do miss some of the 3.1.1 features.
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swf · Member Joined: 16 Feb 2005 Posts: 142 Location: Hollywood

Let's hope Steinberg has a fix for this in the next update.
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scared · Member Joined: 06 Jan 2005 Posts: 335 Location: nny

have you tried updating your syncrosoft drivers? if i remember correctly moving midi data in the key editor is one of the times sx accesses the dongle. i hate to bring up a nasty subject, but "back in the day" (sx 1.x), this was the reason the [k]'s of sx didn't work: dongle access would crash sx. it pretty much only showed up in the key editor, if i remember correctly. yes… i know i now look like a bad guy, but info like that is sometimes helpful, no?

so, i'd try updating the syncrosoft drivers (make sure the dongle is isn't plugged in), and then try directly connecting the dongle to your mac. there might be a problem with the hub it's plugged into…

swf · Member Joined: 16 Feb 2005 Posts: 142 Location: Hollywood

Hey scared,

Thank you for your reply. Its appreciated.

I updated the syncrosoft software with the dongle unplugged, restarted the computer and plugged the dongle directly into the computer, launched Cubase, and unfortunatly still have the same problem. (Midi Editor freezes, note hangs, beach ball of death) Thanks for trying. If you have any more suggestions or anyone else I'm listening.

I'd still like to see if I can get this fixed befor downgrading. I'm mean I just upgraded! Laughing

swf
_________________
www.ferrispark.com
MacBook Pro Duo Core 2.2 2 GB ram, 4 80 gig OWC Mercury Hard Drives, OSX 10.4.9, Cubase 4, Traktor Scratch, Live 6.0, Yamaha Motif6, Ensoniq ASR-10

scared · Member Joined: 06 Jan 2005 Posts: 335 Location: nny

hrm… well, still going on the idea that it's a problem with the dongle, how about this:

can you launch the license control center application? if not, that's almost definitely your problem. you can scan the crash log for the license control center (using the console application) to try to determine what is causing the problem. skip down to the Binary Image Description section and look at each application it lists. try removing/turning off things until you can launch the license control center.

a long time ago, i had a problem with cocoagestures not liking the lcc.

the same thing, actually, goes for sx: if it's crashing, you should have a crash log. hunt through the binary image description section to look for things "out of the ordinary".

good luck!

dave.

p.s. the only other thing i can think of would be a midi feedback loop. dragging notes around will cause them to play (by default), so if you're outs lead to your ins, that would cause feedback. sx used to handle midi feedback semi-gracefully, but lately it likes to lock the whole system…

swf · Member Joined: 16 Feb 2005 Posts: 142 Location: Hollywood

Hey Scared,

My License Control Center opens fine. I looked at the SX3 crash log but I wouldn't know what looks out of the oridinary. I think I'll open SX3 get it to crash by moving the midi part then go into the Console app and copy and past the Brinary info in this post. I'll also look at the midi connections within SX3. I'm using a usb connection from my Motif 6 to my Powerbook. Maybe the midi software for the motif to SX needs to be updated? Or the software for the Ozone to SX needs an update? I'll check Yamaha's and M-Audio's websites for updates.

Thank you again for your help. It is always greatly appreciated. I'd really like to get this figured out.

Best,
'
Scott
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scared · Member Joined: 06 Jan 2005 Posts: 335 Location: nny

those all sound like good ideas.

i'd paste the entire crash log to be safe. there might be something hiding out in there…

out of curiosity, have you tried "basic" things like trying a clean set of preferences? quit out of sx, move the ~/Library/Preferences/Cubase SX 3 folder to the desktop and then relaunch sx.

if that doesn't help, you can trash the new preferences folder and put your original back (make sure sx isn't running while you do it).

you could also check to see if a vst(i) is causing the problem. move the contents of both /Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/VST and ~/Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/VST to temporary folders on your desktop and relaunch sx. if the problem goes away, start putting them back one by one (ah… os 9 extension style…)

more good luck!

dave.

swf · Member Joined: 16 Feb 2005 Posts: 142 Location: Hollywood

Hey Dave,

This is the last batch of Binary Images from the bottom going up in Console (crash log: Cubase SX 3). (I hope it puts the last crash at the bottom and not at the top of the Console window, if not I'll post top to bottom) I just made it crash after updating the Motif Midi drivers. So we know its not the midi drivers for the Motif and its not the Dongle. I think, right?

I see it says something about core audio and core midi referencing 3.1.1, but why does it say things about language converters?

Do you see anything strange? It all looks strange to me Laughing

I'll wait for your reply then I'll start trying your other suggestions.

Thank you again and again and again...sf

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0x9466d000 - 0x946f0fff libstdc++.6.dylib /usr/lib/libstdc++.6.dylib
0x95fc6000 - 0x95fc7fff libCyrillicConverter.dylib /System/Library/CoreServices/Encodings/libCyrillicConverter.dylib
0x95fc9000 - 0x95fcafff libGreekConverter.dylib /System/Library/CoreServices/Encodings/libGreekConverter.dylib
0x95fcf000 - 0x95fe5fff libJapaneseConverter.dylib /System/Library/CoreServices/Encodings/libJapaneseConverter.dylib
0x95fe7000 - 0x96007fff libKoreanConverter.dylib /System/Library/CoreServices/Encodings/libKoreanConverter.dylib
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scared · Member Joined: 06 Jan 2005 Posts: 335 Location: nny

yep, afaik, new crash logs are appended to the end (bottom) of the crash log.

i don't see anything out of the ordinary, but i'm by no means an expert at reading crash logs…

on to other things…

swf · Member Joined: 16 Feb 2005 Posts: 142 Location: Hollywood

Hey scared,

I moved the Cubase SX3 Preferences and VST folders to another location and relaunched SX but it still crashed when I moved a part in the key editor. It also loaded the old preferences (SX2) so in reality they might be the same preferences wether i move them or not.

I did notice that one of my exterior hard drives goes crazy (by crazy I mean spinning and flashing) when the midi editor freezes and the deadly beach ball starts spinning. You think that has anything to do with it?

thanks,sf
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swf · Member Joined: 16 Feb 2005 Posts: 142 Location: Hollywood

Alright, this problem is quickly becoming a major one. My workflow has been seriously hindered. I use the KEY EDITOR almost as much or more then any other editor in SX. In the last half hour I have had to restart my computer six times, I can not work like this, I am rebooting more then I am working. I payed for an upgrade to SX3.1 to fix problems with SX2 that Seinberg wouldn't fix. Funny though, I'm still in the same situation. Can anyone from Steinberg (moderators) please chime in here? I would like to resolve this problem as soon as possible. I have updated Cubase, my drivers, my OS, and my License Control. I have started new preferences in SX and posted a crash log above. Still my computer is getting the "beach ball of death" when I move midi parts (notes) inside the key editor. I do not wish to fix my problem by downgrading to SX3. I will if this is the only answer but, I have to admit this is starting to sound like "upgrade to SX3 to fix SX2" except now its "downgrade to SX3 to fix SX3.1" I'm actually moving backwards when I would love to be moving forward. Can Steinberg please give me a strait answer, should I call tech support?

thanks,

swf
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prism · Posted: Sat Feb 11, 2006 11:40 pm Post subject:

I sympathise with you. I have not been able to solve it, and like you I can not work like that. All I can advise is to downgrade to 3.0.2 like I have done. It works, and you can at least get some music done without the constant SBOD lock-ups. I'm hoping that SX3.2 will have this problem solved.

Best Wishes

bayswater · Member Joined: 21 Mar 2005 Posts: 700 Location: Vancouver

Someone suggested that the problem is a Mac issue, or that its a problem with SX 3.1. I'm not so sure. Over the past few weeks I have imported a lot of older Atari Cuabse songs with a lot MIDI and done a lot of MIDI editing, involving duplicating and moving large blocks of events, etc. in the key editor. Everything was very stable. But I did have crashing problems on my G4 whenever I tried to do a lot of rapid edits (not just MIDI), particularly those involving moving the mouse in and out of an edit window quickly and quickly selecting different things around the screen. Seemed like Cubase couldn't "lkeep up" and eventually got confused and gave up. Never happens on the G5. Maybe its just a problem with raw processing power. If so, the problem will go away if you slow down -- not a useful suggestion, but it may help diagnose the situation.
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digitalgeist · Posted: Sun Feb 12, 2006 4:23 am Post subject:

I've heard from more than one source that the MIDI edit crash problem is actually a result of the dongle/copy protection! Something about the anti-piracy coding with Cubase forcing the program to do unnecessary calculations, therefore eating up processor speed and RAM... I don't know anything about coding though, so maybe I'm just talking out of my arse here.
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prism · Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 6:12 pm Post subject:

bump
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swf · Member Joined: 16 Feb 2005 Posts: 142 Location: Hollywood

I'm still crashing and still waiting for some sort of answer from the Steinberg people. As of late I have been using the "Drum Editor" as the "Key Editor". Wow, what a pain in the arse. Any new updates soon? I'm a stubborn bastard and I refuse to downgrade... Laughing

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0dB · Posted: Tue Feb 28, 2006 11:17 am Post subject:

i had this problem too an open a thread therefor a while ago. fortunately prism knew a workaround though i can make some music. unfortunately they´ve said, there will be no sx3.2 update to fix it...so bump it up
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0dB · Posted: Wed Mar 01, 2006 10:41 am Post subject:

so, where is the official statement about that?
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quantize · Posted: Wed Mar 01, 2006 11:13 am Post subject:

never had this happen *ever* across 2xg5's, 1xg4 or our pc...but i sympathise - it must
be extremely frustrating...

you could start looking at other factors...ie (and i know this is obvious)

tried swapping the usb ports? any other usb devices with drivers possibly interfering?
any other macs you can test the dongle with?

oh and u did repair your permissions and all that yeh?
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swf · Member Joined: 16 Feb 2005 Posts: 142 Location: Hollywood

Hey quantize,

How do I go about repairing permissions?

I unplugged everything to do with midi and still got a beach ball. I unplugged my Ozone, Motif, and Mouse. No luck. (the only usb plugged directly into the computer was the dongle)

I'm thinking about removing my drivers and seeing what happens. The only drivers I have in the computer are for the M-Audio Ozone and the Yamaha Motif. Do you think that has anything to do with it?

Let's say I only plug in the dongle and nothing else and remove the drivers for everything else midi related. If the beach ball appears again would this help prove the problem is coming from the dongle? Maybe? or something within Cubase atleast?

thanks

swf
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prism · Posted: Wed Mar 01, 2006 4:38 pm Post subject:

swf · Member Joined: 16 Feb 2005 Posts: 142 Location: Hollywood

Hello all,

I have just repaired permissions and I'm still having the same problem with the Key Editor.

swf
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IlMolto · Posted: Wed Mar 01, 2006 11:35 pm Post subject:

swf,

Out of curiosity, where is your USB Protection Key plugged into?

This problem has happened to me aswell, but not until I plugged my USB Key into my Apple keyboard, rather than the G5 itelf. I've tried Cubase for a short while after plugging it back into the G5, and so far so good.

Looking forward to your response.

Daniel
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